Jackula
I have 3 Cat8C's and 2 submersives and I'm interested in getting them in running stereo for music.

Problem is, the SQ of my Marantz AV7702 suck. When I connect my $7k DAC to the Cat8C's, they sound better than Focal Utopia floorstanders, but they are missing the bottom end.

All the top preamps don't have SW outs or the ability to configure the crossover, some of the cheaper ones do (i.e. Emotiva) but don't have XLR bypass or output.

Can anyone suggest a method of connecting Cat8C's to Submersives?
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audioguy
Split the output of your dac. Run one connector to the Cat8 and the other to a $350 miniDSP 2x2 balanced. Let the Cats roll off naturally (about 12db per octave) and create a crossover on the subs with the miniDSP.

Problem solved but you will need REW or OmniMic to pull this off!! The miniiDSP will also allow u to set trim and distance of your subs.

And i know this works because i have done it!
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Jackula
Thanks mate, sounds like a lot of work just to run them in stereo.

I can't seem to find miniDSP 2x2 balanced on their website, the closest they have is 2x4. I suppose this means I won't have to split the output on my DAC, the miniDSP already splits it for me and I can configure the crossover from there? If that's true, sweet!

What's it like configuring a miniDSP? Do I just connect to it with my PC?
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audioguy
This product is what I was referring to.

http://www.minidsp.com/products/opendrc-series/opendrc-an

And you purchase a software download for $10 that allows you to configure it with a PC (or Mac.

It does take some experimentation and I suggest reading some of the forums on the minidsp products to get started.

But you WILL need either REW or OmniMIc to get the results you need.

There are all kinds of things you can do\: set crossivers (high and low pass), shelf filters, PEQ's trims and distances.

It will do exactly waht you want and you won't be altering the signal to your Cats since it will run directly off the DAC.

Have fun!!!!

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Jackula
Why would I need an OmniMic?

I can just set the crossover & distances from my Audyssey calibration?
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audioguy
Without measurement, you are guessing.  How are you going to EQ the subs without measuring?  

If you expect to maximize your 2 channel experience, you will need to measure.  You have lots of  money tied up in your two subs and Cats so why not spend another $300  for OmniMic (or learn REW for close to nothing) and maximize your audio. 9 both 2 channel and surround.

But you get to do what you want to do.  

Have fun!!

Over ....AND OUT!!!!!

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Jackula
The speakers will run off the AV7702 for movies only. Music will be run through my DAC & preamp & (as suggested) a MiniDSP 2x4, but rather than calibrating calibrating the MiniDSP with a OmniMic, I'm hoping I can just copy the Audyssey settings off my AV7702?
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audioguy
So how are going to eq the subs for 2 channel since the Audyssey filters are in the 7702?
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Jackula
I'm hoping the 7702 will have an option that lets me view the Audyssey EQ values, I assume this isn't the case? Is EQ really necessary for stereo use, the speakers in my lounge plays fine without any calibration.
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audioguy
I have NEVER been in a room where bass EQ would not make a large difference.

I don't think the Audyssey filters in your 7702 are accessible and if they were, they are not PEQ filters.

You asked how to connect your subs and mains together without using the 7702 because you think it sounds horrible.  I offered you a very inexpensive and effective way to do so that I know works.  I have been in and around the audio business for over 40 years.  I can't explain it any better than I already have.

I suggest you go elsewhere and get answers from someone you have a bit more faith in.  PM Mark and see what he tells you or wait until someone else responds.  I have no more to offer.  

Sorry I could not be of more assistance.




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Jackula
Sounds like you were offended by something I said, that was not my intention. I do value your opinion but I wouldn't have blind faith in them, especially for a stereo setup where hearing becomes a very subjective experience. The best I can do is to take it under consideration.

A unit ten times the price of 7702, I don't have that kind of money and that sounds like some kind of pre/pro to me. Gotta try it with a standalone DAC or at least separates with zero (or close to zero) processing to get the difference out of them Seatons. The problem with Seatons are their speed and transparency, but I do like their overall presentation more than other flagships. Currently I'm considering another speaker that also have built-in amplification and sound much much better - for music. So I have to weigh the risks of going down the upgrade path for Seaton Catalysts (cost + effort) vs upgrading my stereo setup outright.

You must be kidding about contacting Mark, he makes great speakers but everyone knows he's not the best with answering emails, PMs or phone calls.

All the best!
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calentz

Jackula wrote:
.......You must be kidding about contacting Mark, he makes great speakers but everyone knows he's not the best with answering emails, PMs or phone calls.

All the best!

He has always been very prompt in answering my E-Mails & when I have called he has always answered, even when he has been out of town (Calls forwarded to his cell phone)

Carl
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Jackula
He never answers my emails and calls often rings out, even when redirected to his cell. I know many others who have the same experience.

His products are great but I dread the day when one of the amps die and I need to wait 2 years to get it repaired.
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calentz

I am sorry, but I have nothing but good things to say about Mark. The first of Mark's speakers I got was two used SubMs from

the person that started the "Seaton Sound SubMersive1" thread on AVS. (I believe he was moving to China)

Mark supplied the boxes. When I received them, noticed that the grill cloth was sagging some & called him to ask what was

recommended to use for adhesive. He said that he was making then differently now and to send them to him and he would take

care of them. He had them shipped back to me the next day after he received them - shipping at his expense & at no charge to me.

I feel that that is exceptional service, as I did not even buy the SubMs directly from him! That led me to purchase three Cat 12Cs and

do the Amp upgrades to the SubMs. I have had a few additional problems as would be expected, but they were always handled in

a timely manner.

Carl
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Mark_Seaton
Jackula wrote:
I have 3 Cat8C's and 2 submersives and I'm interested in getting them in running stereo for music.

Problem is, the SQ of my Marantz AV7702 suck. When I connect my $7k DAC to the Cat8C's, they sound better than Focal Utopia floorstanders, but they are missing the bottom end.

All the top preamps don't have SW outs or the ability to configure the crossover, some of the cheaper ones do (i.e. Emotiva) but don't have XLR bypass or output.

Can anyone suggest a method of connecting Cat8C's to Submersives?


Hi Jack,

I was traveling last weekend for an audio show when this popped up earlier in the week, and when I glanced on my phone, it looked like there were plenty of good suggestions.  An e-mail is always the best way to catch me for international customers.

If you can find one used, the easy solution is to grab a Velodyne SMS-1.  Alternately, the Antimode Dual Core can offer automated correction and low pass filtering.  It might take some tinkering to get the levels to match with the main speakers, but shouldn't be a problem with the Catalysts.  This would have you splitting the output, one direct to the Catalyst 8Cs, one to the Dual core.  The same would be true using the SMS-1.  

The inexpensive balanced, 2x4 miniDSP could always be used just as a subwoofer crossover, with or without the 8C's running through it.  With the sealed roll off of the 8C's you could get lucky blending them, but you would of course get much more reliable results if you pick up a UM-IK microphone and get REW working.

The inclusion of a subwoofer low pass will be addressed in the next couple days for those ordering new units.
Mark Seaton
Seaton Sound, Inc.
sales@seatonsound.net
773-290-8436
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Jackula
Hi Mark, surprised and thankful by your response.

If connecting to 8C, would that be to the looping output? I think since HT bypass generally only has FR & FL and if I had to constantly swap cables between music and movie duties, that is a PITA!

I've also been doing some research of my own, have you had any experience with an Emotiva XSP-1? It seems to have HT bypass for subs and also crossover config for mains too. But there's nowhere near me to demo a unit so I don't know how they sound compared to the Plinius Kaitaki.
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