Kain
I like the 8C's size but the 12C's SPL capabilities. I was wondering if it is possible to make a 8C with the 12C's amplifier? If so, would there be any real benefits in terms of headroom? Just like the SubMersive got a HP version, I was wondering if adding a more powerful amplifier would benefit the 8C in any way?
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Mark_Seaton
Kain wrote:
I like the 8C's size but the 12C's SPL capabilities. I was wondering if it is possible to make a 8C with the 12C's amplifier? If so, would there be any real benefits in terms of headroom? Just like the SubMersive got a HP version, I was wondering if adding a more powerful amplifier would benefit the 8C in any way?


The only benefit would be if I can charge you for replacement woofers... as it would be too easy to damage them if you really push the levels. [eek]

To summarize, the 8C woofers don't really have any more to give beyond the very significant output they already have.  What you are asking about is the reason I intend to offer an 8ST, but remember 12C is still more powerful at the lower frequencies.  Of course this gets back to real usage and the integration of subwoofers.

In a small room like we set up at THE Show Newport, the 8C's paired with 4 SubMersives were brutally powerful when crossed about 80Hz as I recall.  When really pushing the levels you do exercise the 8C woofers a good bit, but that was at some pretty hair-raising playback levels.  Most underestimate just how powerful a system with 8Cs and 2 or more SubMersives really is.
Mark Seaton
Seaton Sound, Inc.
sales@seatonsound.net
773-290-8436
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Kain
Thanks. [smile]

Looking at the Newport link you provided, the hotel room was about 13' x 17-20' deep. If the 8Cs caused some mayhem in that room, I'm sure they will do just fine in mine. The room I am trying to plan out for a new home theater is about 11' wide x 12' deep x 9-10' high. I realize that a room that is a perfect square or close to a square is not ideal for audio but I really don't have any other choice. While I am excited for 8ST, I think I'll have to stick with the 8C as I intend to get 2 SubMersive HPi+s and 2 HP-Slaves and place the front left/right and surround left/right 8Cs on top of them (a pair of subwoofers up front and a pear at the back/rear) as I have no other place to locate the subwoofers. The center 8C will be placed on a stand or A/V shelf/rack. Basically, I'm planning a 5.1.4 (but really a 5.4.4). The 4 ceiling speakers will most likely be the updated Spark with external amplification (if that will be an option).

By the way, any estimates on a max continuous and peak SPL capabilities of the 8C?
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Mark_Seaton
Kain wrote:
Thanks. [smile]

Looking at the Newport link you provided, the hotel room was about 13' x 17-20' deep. If the 8Cs caused some mayhem in that room, I'm sure they will do just fine in mine. The room I am trying to plan out for a new home theater is about 11' wide x 12' deep x 9-10' high. I realize that a room that is a perfect square or close to a square is not ideal for audio but I really don't have any other choice. While I am excited for 8ST, I think I'll have to stick with the 8C as I intend to get 2 SubMersive HPi+s and 2 HP-Slaves and place the front left/right and surround left/right 8Cs on top of them (a pair of subwoofers up front and a pear at the back/rear) as I have no other place to locate the subwoofers. The center 8C will be placed on a stand or A/V shelf/rack. Basically, I'm planning a 5.1.4 (but really a 5.4.4). The 4 ceiling speakers will most likely be the updated Spark with external amplification (if that will be an option).

By the way, any estimates on a max continuous and peak SPL capabilities of the 8C?


Maximum numbers are messy as few understand what they mean and you can give a few different numbers that all have valid meaning but none of which tell the whole story...

  1. 1m sine wave limitations on the low end give a worst case limit of around 115dB, but boundaries and acoustics boost this range in-room.
  2. 1m maximum single frequency is more than 122dB @ 1m (+3dB peak).
  3. 1m music/pink noise type output from 1 speaker would be 120-126dB depending on exact criteria.  This is where the tri-amplification of the Catalyst 8C really gives an advantage over a passive design when producing a wide spectrum of sound (ie most movie and music content).
  4. Some manufacturers like to quote the 1m maximum music output from a pair of speakers which could easily be 126-129dB.
Pick which one makes you feel best, or learn the differences and how they relate to real use.
Mark Seaton
Seaton Sound, Inc.
sales@seatonsound.net
773-290-8436
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Kain
Awesome, thanks for the info! I think number 3 gives me the best idea of the potential real-world performance.
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ChrisM


     I currently have 3 CAT 8's LFC and 2 Submersives (HP+ and Slave) and man is it capable of being loud and clean.   I've had a lot of home and car systems over the years and this is currently tops.  It's actually close to the car feel as with the 2 submersives it feels like someone is banging on the back of my couch.  It is very impressive.   It will go louder than you can really listen to for very long.  With movies when the peaks hit if will sometimes scare the crap out of you.

Chris...
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vNYC
As someone who has both 12Cs and 8Cs, I can tell you that you'll be fine with 8Cs in that room. I also think you might do better with 2 Submersives that can be optimally placed vs 4 that potentially aren't.
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Kain
Thanks guys. [smile]
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